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Mark on “Follow the Money”

October 6, 2010

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  • mkf October 26, 2010 10:45 am

    i look at the above thread, and a pattern emerges: i argue with facts and reason, and you respond with baseless, feel-good emotion.

    because as soon as your above workers were unionized, the hotels and restaurants would fire them and hire the next wave of un-unionized workers flooding across the border (you know, the ones who would be encouraged to come because of the pro-illegal policies you espouse).

    the only way to stop the endlessly succeeding waves of immigrants devaluing the previous wave’s wages would be to put up a wall–but that will never happen under the democrats’ watch, because that would be mean.

    see where this is going?

    reagan (yes, reagan) promised that back with the last amnesty happened [in, what 1986?] that they’d crack down after that. what happened instead? encouraged by their predecessors’ success, 20+ million more mexicans and central americans flooded across the border over the next 30 years, all expecting their amnesty, too.

    and in that time, california went from the golden state to the third-world state.

    i’ve sent you the heritage foundation’s carefully-compiled figures about the 3:1 ratio between what illegals take vs. what they give back. you never responded.

    i’ve pointed out the fact that california, the illegal-immigrant capital of the world, is collapsing under its own weight [and i should know–i live there].

    and none of it penetrates your happy-shiny worldview.

    let’s suspend this argument until we can continue it in person [i.e., until i can look you in the eye and smack you upside the head as i make my points one by one 😉 ].

  • Mark October 26, 2010 9:50 am

    P.S. The only difference between today’s Mexicans and our ancestors of
    “yesteryear” is that America’s doors were more open a century and two ago. Today’s Mexican immigrants, like our ancestors, work very very hard, taking awful jobs under terrible conditions that “established Americans” don’t want. They keep prices down. Frankly, they even depress wages (which is why I’d like to see them unionized and abusive employers punished), but that’s not their fault.

    They’re just trying to pursue the American Dream, as our ancestors did, and they commit less crime as a percentage of the population than American citizens. So deport and jail the criminals. But let Jose the gardener and Juanita the hotel maid stay. They will stay and have children that grow up to be doctors, lawyers, engineers, teachers, scientists, businessmen and businesswomen.

    In sum, they — like every other wave of immigrants before them — will become part of the glorious mosaic that is America. And we have room. Maybe not in crowded Southern California, but I guarantee you there’s lots of room in Montana (and even some bargains east of Los Angeles).

  • Mark October 26, 2010 9:43 am

    I disagree with you, mkf, about immigrants. Immigrants contribute to this country far more than they take away from it. And the undocumented workers who arrive illegally contribute even more. How so? Because while they use very few benefits (all they get is emergency room care and public education), they finance our social security system. Their fake numbers mean they put a full 15% of their wages into the system and don’t get a penny out! That shores up social security and Medicare for you and me.

    So I’m afraid I have to dismiss your claim that “today’s huddled masses demand (and get) an ever-increasing social safety net from the government” as empty rhetoric.

    But we agree on the answer to the fuel crisis: Get away from oil! Use wind, solar, even nuclear, electric cars. Brazil runs 80% of its public-vehicle fleet on sugar cane. That’s right. Sugar cane! Which, for them, is abundant, clean, and natural. Are Brazilians smarter than Americans? Can’t we do something similar here if we didn’t have oil companies standing in the way of innovation?

    So I’m glad we agree on something. Carter was a lousy president in many ways but he was absolutely right about our energy future. And I’m glad you’ve traded your truck in for a prius.

    Now that we agree on energy, I really wish you would stop out-LouDobbsing Lou Dobbs on immigration. Really, they’re a net gain. And if we fine them and allow them to come out of the shadows and pay their taxes, they’ll be even more productive. Fine the employers that hire them too (severely), and we have a nice little nest egg here to deal with the massive deficits.