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Challenging the Ohio Electors

January 7, 2005

(broadcast stream ) (.wma download)
Special Friday Show!
History happened yesterday, and I was there. For the first time since 1876, Congress challenged a slate of Presidential electors.
I happen to know a good deal about challenges to Presidential Electors on the Floor of Congress. I drafted the challenge to Bush’s first term which was heard on Janury 6, 2001 and featured in Michael Moore’s movie Fahrenheit 9/11.
Today, we’ll discuss how the challenge works legally, the goals of the 2005 challenge, and whether there is any hope in this country for electoral reform.
–Mark Levine

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  • Nathan January 10, 2005 9:48 am

    Although I agree with you that democrats need to get over THIS election, there is a larger issue at stake. I do believe President Bush was the rightful winner, but I also agree there are voting procedures that need to be improved on.
    Just out of curiosity, do you have any reason to not use a paper reciept for electronic voting machines in future? Do you know why top republicans in congress are blocking this innitiative?
    This challenge wasn’t so much to change the outcome of this election (I don’t think) but more to call attention to voting procedures that need changed. I don’t support challenging the legitimacy of President Bush’s presidency, but I do support voting reform for future elections.

  • Randy January 10, 2005 5:56 am

    OK,listened to this and agree that Shmuly came across as less than “helpful”….but Democrats need to get over it and move on to other things….see the following report…(from Talon News.)
    “A joint session of Congress resumed proceedings Thursday evening and quickly ratified President George W. Bush’s November election victory after DEMOCRATS FAILED in their attempt to overturn the 20 electoral votes from Ohio which were won by Bush. Certification was halted for the majority of the afternoon when Sen. Barbara Boxer (D-CA) and Rep. Stephanie Tubbs Jones (D-OH) STOPPED the formal declaration process.
    The House voted 267 to 31 AGAINST the challenge, and the Senate voted 74 to 1. Boxer, the lone dissenter, still felt it was worth the effort.MOST DEMOCRATS CONCLUDED BUSH WAS THE RIGHTFUL WINNER.
    “[Democrats] are still not over the 2000 election, let alone the 2004 election.”
    House Majority Leader Tom DeLay (R-TX) characterized the Democrats’ move as a “quadrennial crying wolf.”
    The challenge divided Democrats. Party leaders and many rank-and-file distanced themselves. Black and liberal lawmakers embraced it. Sen. John KERRY (D-MA), who lost the election to Bush, said in a letter sent to supporters Wednesday he would not take part in a formal protest of the Ohio Electors because, despite widespread reports of voting irregularities, his legal team had “FOUND NO EVIDENCE that would change the outcome of the election.”
    I think the American people spoke very clearly on Election Day,” McClellan said. “And the election is behind us. The American people now expect their leaders in Washington to focus on the big priorities facing this country, and to act on those priorities. It is time to move forward, and not engage in conspiracy theories or partisan politics of this nature.”
    Democratic officials in Ohio said that, while they desire improved election practices, they worry that the party was wasting time and money.”

  • Vicky January 9, 2005 2:10 pm

    Just listened to this broadcast – Mark, you asked if we were as annoyed as you were with Shmuly’s avoidance of your question. I don’t know if I was more annoyed or embarrassed on his behalf – if he didn’t want to answer you he should have said so at the beginning – apparently he thought he was going to get you off the topic. I found him very obnoxious.

  • Sue January 9, 2005 12:22 pm

    Thanks Mark! I will look forward to listening to the fixed file and the follow-up on Monday. btw – Here are my comments from what I observed on Thursday in the park that we met. There was a short discussion on starting an Orange Party in Democratic Underground.
    Here is the post about Thursday that I added to that thread:
    Thought I’d share my Jan. 6 protest story about what the color orange looked like for me on that dark day in Washington. I carpooled down with a complete stranger, connected by online activism, who is active in totally different causes than mine. What we shared in common were the values that you listed in the Orange Party Platform. This could be a way of reframing ourselves as a peoples movement that could attract real patriots from every party.
    Shock & Awe Politics vs. the Orange Passion People
    I posted these comments on
    DU) after returning from DC for the Capital protest. 
    DU is where I crawled to after the  election and it’s been a very interesting place to explore.  I guess it’s finally time to accept what we were unable to change — but,  it was an awesome day for us in DC –  attempting to breathe the last hope of life into the dinosaur that has become of our democratic process.
    DU posts:
    The Bushies used the same style of attack (shock and awe) on us in this election as they have in every other democracy that they’ve disrupted.
    ‘We the people’ have been abused and it’s hard for a lot of
    people to admit it. But, the awesome power that I experienced
    outside the capital at RedefeatBush rally was orange passion, it helped to brighten the dark skies  over Washington.   I’m so glad I made it.
    Mounds of evidence.  Now in the Congressional Record. More is sure to come. It’s only t a matter of time before the brilliant, thoughtful and creative people out here in these amazing ‘Internets’ weave sounds and images together into a symphony that will help a critical mass accept our truths and celebrate our heroes.
    The day ended with a song by Steve Earle … “The Revolution starts …  Now!”
    Here’s my earlier post with more details:
    Yes, It was chilly today at the Capital, but not uncomfortably so. The crowd was smaller than I’d hoped, but it was glowing with passion. The color orange was everywere!
    I just really enjoyed being up close and personal with the
    characters that have had their work grace the threads of DU
    since I entered here after Nov. 3. It’s a beginning of a new
    movement that can only grow as the amazing people who
    worked so hard to document the fraud and who DID
    stand up today make history. They will need the support by
    the thousands and thousands of us to sustain them and raise awareness.
    More challengers would have been great today, but one is all we needed.
    It’s a beginning.
    Everyone who contributed to the combined effort should be a proud orange!

  • Mark Levine January 8, 2005 4:19 pm

    Sue, I checked out the stream and the download. I had no problem with the stream. But the download, as you said, failed to work about 11 minutes into the broadcast. I have replaced it, and it works now (at least on my computer).
    If anyone has any technical problems with ANY of the archives, please email me at [email protected]. Be as specific as possible — as Sue was — as to what works and what doesn’t, any error message, the type of computer you’re using, and whether the Internet connection is dial-up or broadband.
    P.S. Glad to see you at the protest, Sue. It’s always fun to meet my many listeners that I don’t know exist! Not that there’s anything wrong with the thousands of you that don’t post to the blog or call in to the radio show but it’s really great for me to hear from you once in awhile.